DANIEL ESTRIN, HOST:
Before last night's dramatic operations in Venezuela, which saw U.S. forces capturing the country's president, Nicolas Maduro, and his wife, President Trump, as well as members of his cabinet, downplayed talk of regime change. However, that very possibility dominated the conversation, and for months, U.S. operations against Venezuela have been escalating without any congressional oversight.
Senator Jeanne Shaheen is a ranking member of the Senate Foreign Relations Committee and a senior member of the Senate Armed Services Committee. She's a Democrat representing New Hampshire, and she joins us now. Good afternoon, Senator.
JEANNE SHAHEEN: Good afternoon.
ESTRIN: We've seen reports of some lawmakers being briefed on the overnight attack in Venezuela. We also heard the president say this morning that he was worried about Congress leaking it. The question is, were you briefed? And if so, were you informed of the plans?
SHAHEEN: I was not informed. And my understanding is that no one else was informed in advance, either, both Republican and Democrat. And worse than that, what we have heard from the administration in response to direct questions from both Republicans and Democrats for months has been that their intent was not regime change. Now, of course, those of us who were watching the region understood that there had to be some reason for putting 15,000 U.S. troops in the Caribbean region and all of the firepower that we were bringing to that region. But the fact that they not only refused to brief Congress, but also did not tell us the truth about what the intentions were, and what the president and others acknowledged in this press conference was that they've been planning this operation for months.
And there's no doubt that the military behaved brilliantly, but now they're talking about nation-building. And the president's press conference raised more questions than it answered because he said that the United States is going to run the country of Venezuela, but what we're hearing from the vice president, who he claims has been sworn in now as president, what we're hearing from the finance minister, what we're hearing from other quarters, is that there's going to be a battle for control of Venezuela. And there's no guarantee who's going to wind up in control there or to what extent the drug cartels are still going to have a role.
ESTRIN: And since the attack this morning, have you or your colleagues been informed by U.S. officials on what's next?
SHAHEEN: No. No. And again, the president was not at all clear in his press conference, as he has not been for months, about what the real goal is in Venezuela. He talked about the effort to prohibit drugs from coming into the United States, which I think all Americans support. But what they have done, while it's addressed drugs coming in by boat from Venezuela, hasn't addressed drugs coming in from other areas. And he also talked about oil, the need to get back oil for the United States. He talked about the activities from criminals who are - were being pushed into the United States by Maduro. But these are all contradictory statements, and he's still not clear about what the real motive here is in Venezuela and the threat that the country posed to the United States.
ESTRIN: You know, the president also spoke about sending U.S. oil companies to Venezuela. Was that ever discussed? Because it seemed off the stated mission of fighting drug traffickers and restoring democracy.
SHAHEEN: I have not had any conversations with anyone in the oil industry about what they might be willing to invest in Venezuela. And again, just as with nation-building, we have a very mixed record in terms of restoring the oil industry. That was the explanation for why the war in Iraq wasn't going to cost us anything, because they had such oil reserves, and we know that that didn't turn out to be true. So whether - the extent to which the United States is going to be able to take over the oil reserves of Venezuela, I think, still is not clear. And what we're seeing already is our adversaries coming to the defense of Maduro and Venezuela, and our allies not taking a firm stand on what the president is doing. So I don't think this has contributed to America's national security interests. And what we're seeing is Russia and China talking about continuing to support the interests in Venezuela that they've been supporting for years now.
ESTRIN: Senator, Congress has been frankly unable to stop President Trump in the last several months from all of the military action that's been taken against Venezuela, from the deadly strikes on boats to now regime change. Do you think there will now be enough buy-in among your colleagues for a War Powers Resolution?
SHAHEEN: Well, I think that remains to be seen. I hope that my colleagues on both sides of the aisle will raise questions about what's really going on here in Venezuela and why we're - you know, this is a president who said he was for America first, and yet what he's talking about is potentially another land war in Latin America. So I think - hopefully we will see...
ESTRIN: OK.
SHAHEEN: ...People be willing to question the president.
ESTRIN: Senator Jeanne Shaheen, thank you so much. Transcript provided by NPR, Copyright NPR.
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